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DanC
09-15-2011, 08:01 PM
Sorry if i am posting this in an inappropriate spot. Haven't had a chance to check out the site yet, But i need some advice really soon. My zebra tarantula Aphonopelma Seemanni has been stuck in her exuviae since He began shedding aprox 5 days ago. His 2 back middle legs and pedipalps are still in the molt. I own many tarantulas for many years and have never encountered this problem before. What should i do? I have heard of pulling out the legs and hoping for the best, But that is a total of 4 appendages. Sounds like a lot of trauma. What would be the most humane form of euthanasia? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

malhomme
09-15-2011, 08:10 PM
Sorry if i am posting this in an inappropriate spot. Haven't had a chance to check out the site yet, But i need some advice really soon. My zebra tarantula Aphonopelma Seemanni has been stuck in her exuviae since He began shedding aprox 5 days ago. His 2 back middle legs and pedipalps are still in the molt. I own many tarantulas for many years and have never encountered this problem before. What should i do? I have heard of pulling out the legs and hoping for the best, But that is a total of 4 appendages. Sounds like a lot of trauma. What would be the most humane form of euthanasia? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Was your A. seemanni a mature male? If so, it could be attempting a post-ultimate molt. These are rarely successful. If you do not know if it was a mature male, can you attatch pics of your T prior to this molt? (since this is your first post, you will have to make 4 more posts before you can attatch an image)

We can help you more with some information. Five days is an awful long time. :-(

DanC
09-15-2011, 08:41 PM
I know he has those kinda large double spurs on the underside of his two front legs right under the joint witch is why i assume he is a male. I would also assume he is male because he is pretty slender as some male tarantulas i have heard tend to be compared to females. i have probably had him for around five years, and he wasn't quite full grown when i had purchased him. I could upload a photo somewhere else if that would help.

malhomme
09-15-2011, 08:59 PM
Photobucket?

When was his last molt?

DanC
09-15-2011, 09:06 PM
Oh, I see. Every reply=1 post. I'm new to the forum thing. As for last molt I am not sure, I have so many T's And scorps I cant remember exactly. If i had to guess it would be within the past two yrs was last molt. Give me a few and i will try to link some pics.

malhomme
09-15-2011, 09:16 PM
Just any pics where we can see the hooks on his front legs or "boxing gloves" of his palps.

DanC
09-15-2011, 09:26 PM
his boxing gloves are bigger than any t i own hear is a few picks
2-3 yrs ago
second pic is bad molt
3rd pic is june this year
ill get better pics in a few if needed

um.. wont let me post links?

malhomme
09-15-2011, 09:28 PM
As for euthanasia, some people have different opinions re which methods are most humane. Obviously some people will see euthanasia as cruel.

I have not had to euthanize yet but would anesthetize with CO2, then freeze.

Most CO2 methods use baking soda and vinegar to produce the gas. Obviously, the vinegar, baking soda, and tarantula should not be in the same container. It's just a quick way to get the gas if you can't find dry ice.

malhomme
09-15-2011, 09:31 PM
um.. wont let me post links?

One more post I think.

DanC
09-15-2011, 09:35 PM
O.K hear is my next post, Lets see.

DanC
09-15-2011, 09:39 PM
Bad molt pic. I guess i should also mention that she slipped climbing I think and had what seems to be a puncture heal on the back bottom of abdomen. it was at least a couple of months ago, but i dont think it has a lot to do with the bad molt, You can se the white spot on the pick, but her abdomen looks perfectly fine outside of molt.

nop, still wont let me.

DanC
09-15-2011, 09:43 PM
Well, i don't see a way around this, I'm thinking its pretty much over for him. Every molt he has undergone was done with overnight. Don't males tend to have a shorter lifespan? He definitely hasn't gotten much bigger within the last few molts.

***Beth***
09-15-2011, 10:05 PM
OK, is he still trying to get out or has he given up? If still trying you can put his cage in a bathroom and run the hot water as long as you can to create a steam room. This will help loosen the molt a bit. You can also try wetting the stuck areas with a Qtip. If these don't work you might end up having to try helping him out of the molt (only recommended as a last ditch effort). You could try once you steam the room GENTLY pulling the molt, if too much resistance though stop. Try a small pair of scissors and cutting around the molt so that even if it is stuk he can move a few legs etc. Once they're seperated from eachother he'll keep trying to rid himself of the molt or cast off the limb (which is ok if he does this himself). If he cant seperate the legs though and is stuck as a bundled mess he'll most likely give up in which case there may not be much help.

Also try an icu- put him in a small container lined with damp paper towels to raise humidity. Might help. If a post ultimate molt for a mature male though these are very iffy and he still may not make it simply due to old age.

Keep us posted!

malhomme
09-15-2011, 10:06 PM
All things taken together... boxing gloves, hooks, skinny size, pedipaps stuck... it points to a post-ultimate molt. I can't see any way out of this for him. I am very, very sorry. :-(

It is obvious that he has been well cared for, since you've taken the time to figure out how to help him through this.

malhomme
09-15-2011, 10:09 PM
Beth, will that work on a post-ultimate molt?

JumpSpidersInc
09-15-2011, 10:13 PM
DanC, try logging out of the forum and log back in... maybe the forum needs to update your status to allow you to post pics.

I hope your T makes it. Fingers crossed for him!

JSI

***Beth***
09-15-2011, 10:15 PM
malhomme, it'll loosen up the skin still. The legs with hooks might get cast off if he frees them up enough to be able to do so. ...

DanC
09-15-2011, 10:15 PM
Thanks a lot, He hardly moves at all unless i touch him. He always seems to be in the exact same spot every day give a half an inch. I'm gonna give steam and physical removal a try. thanks a lot for your help. I'll let you know. Post-altimate molt huh.... Odd evolutionary quirk. Then again, it sounds like something that happens after genes have been past on.

***Beth***
09-15-2011, 10:19 PM
OH ALSO while doing ANY of this if you end up having to remove limbs, try doing so at the joints and remember the blood won't clot, you'll need to dab it with something like cornstarch, liquid bandaid, super glue, flour... anything that can be used to stop the bleeding. Be careful as this can be tricky and will stress out the T. Limb/molt removal is ONLY tried if NOTHING else works and if the T will die if nothing is done. PLEASE keep us posted!

DanC
09-15-2011, 10:33 PM
15399
this is him in the small transport cage i put him in. at this angle you dont get the full affect of the size of the "boxing gloves" they look bigger than this from the side. Also when you compare the past pics of him witch i will upload, you can tell his legs have gotten much thinner, and his color much darker than he used to have. loosing most of his zebra strip pattern.

DanC
09-15-2011, 10:40 PM
2/3 yrs ago
This is an old pic and his Palps where still growing. before he molted the tips where almost twice as big
15441

malhomme
09-15-2011, 10:41 PM
Another thing that is supposed to help is to apply a drop of glycerine at the location of the stuck molt. This will not harm the spider and will soften it's skin.

JumpSpidersInc
09-15-2011, 10:50 PM
Is he on his back right now, DanC? If so, drop a few drops of water into his mouth. He needs a little to drink...

As a side note, wood chips are not good for a T, even in a temp. situation.

I sure hope you can help him...

JSI

DanC
09-15-2011, 10:59 PM
15442
I just took this one. notice that his legs are a lot thinner and darker compared to the healthy pic above from a few yrs ago. Even his chelicerae are much much smaller all of a sudden. Maybe all that is because he hasn't fully molted and he hasn't filled out yet. I don't understand the mechanism for that so i cant say, but regardless he almost looks like a completely different T. anyway, as a matter of fact, he looks all around smaller. If anyone recognizes these traits as an old T at the end of his life Then that will make me feel much better about this whole situation. O.K. I'll stop bugging you guys and see what i can do. Also, sorry to just jump on the site without even saying Hi first. I'll upload some pics of my pets in the appropriate section later on and introduce myself. Thanks for all the help.

malhomme
09-15-2011, 11:26 PM
15442
I just took this one. notice that his legs are a lot thinner and darker compared to the healthy pic above from a few yrs ago. Even his chelicerae are much much smaller all of a sudden. Maybe all that is because he hasn't fully molted and he hasn't filled out yet. I don't understand the mechanism for that so i cant say, but regardless he almost looks like a completely different T. anyway, as a matter of fact, he looks all around smaller. If anyone recognizes these traits as an old T at the end of his life Then that will make me feel much better about this whole situation. O.K. I'll stop bugging you guys and see what i can do. Also, sorry to just jump on the site without even saying Hi first. I'll upload some pics of my pets in the appropriate section later on and introduce myself. Thanks for all the help.

Well, welcome to the site. We hope you stick around. There's a great bunch of people here.

Many mature male tarantulas look radically different than the did before their ultimate molt. Some look like a completely different species after their final molt. Males live significantly shorter lives than females. When a male "hooks-out", that's it... that's typically his final molt.

Mature males (MM) will eat and drink but a lot of their energies are spent making sperm webs and finding a date. MM's tend to be leggier and skinnier than they were before this final molt.

I guess you've figured out that your MM is trying to make one more molt than nature usually allows. Success is not unheard of, but it's kind of rare too.

Tarantulas have a very fascinating lifecycle.

DanC
09-16-2011, 01:10 AM
Yeah, I knew someone would mention the wood chips. The pet store was closed and it was the only substrate i had leftover. No paper towels either. I guess in hind sight i should have either moistened a face towel or just scrape some of the substrate from his cage out. I just felt uncomfortable with putting him directly on the glass bottom and my slightly panicked concern clouded my judgment. Thanks for lookin out tho.

***Beth***
09-16-2011, 04:44 AM
He is definately mature. malhomme is right in his advice as well. Wood chips really is bad but you seem to know so I won't go into it. Also the T does look like he's old and at the end of his life. He really doesn't have much time left if he does survive this. JSI has a good idea too about the drop of water in the mouth to help rehydrate. He'll fill out a little bit after he hardens and eats some but not much especially not much in the mouth area. It's always rough when a molt goes bad. Good luck with him and I hope he survives this. You're doing all you can it seems.

DanC
09-17-2011, 10:45 PM
Well, I had to us the co2 method. There wasn't anything i could do. To Bad. My only pet I have owned that didn't die a natural death. Thanks for the help Malhomme and Beth.15478
R.I.P. Archimedes

JumpSpidersInc
09-17-2011, 10:52 PM
I'm very sorry to hear this, Dan... you did the best you could...

He was a fine boy, and was lucky to have you.

JSI

***Beth***
09-17-2011, 10:57 PM
:( So sorry :(
You did all you could. At times things beyond our control happens. He's at peace now.

malhomme
09-17-2011, 11:13 PM
I'm very sorry for your loss. If it is any consolation, I believ you did the right, humane thing. Archimedes lived a long and pampered life with an owner that truly cared for him.

Tgirl1010
09-18-2011, 05:50 AM
So sorry for your loss. You did all that you could for him. He was lucky to have a life with someone who cared for him as you did.